Skip to main content
    Beta — Features may not work as expected.
    Back to Podcasts

    RevOps is Dead: Why GTM Ops is the Future

    AM
    Andy MowatWhispered — Founder
    0 views
    Share:

    In this insightful episode, Sugata Sanyal, Founder & CEO of ZINFI, sits down with Andy Mowat, Founder of Whispered and former RevOps leader at Upwork, Box, Culture Amp, and Carta. They dive into the evolution of Revenue Operations (RevOps), which Andy argues is an overused term for what should be called Go-to-Market Ops. The discussion highlights the six core functions of a modern GTM Ops team and the move towards a Modern Data Stack. Andy shares his view that we are in the "dark ages" of systems like Salesforce and must prioritize AI Fluency and the right mindset over just skill sets when hiring. Listen in to understand the future of the operations function and what leadership skills matter most in the age of AI.

    TL;DR

    Andy Mowat reflects on his experience leading revenue operations for four unicorns, including Upwork and Box. He argues that the term RevOps is often misused, suggesting that 'Go-To-Market Ops' better reflects the integration of marketing, sales, and customer success necessary for scaling startups today.

    "Most RevOps people you meet are just sales ops people with a sexier title; true impact comes from integrating marketing and customer success into a unified Go-To-Market function."

    — Andy Mowat

    What We Discussed

    The Evolution of GTM Ops from Sales Operations

    The term RevOps is a relatively new addition to the business lexicon, often acting as a modern rebranding of Sales Operations. Andy explains that at companies like Upwork, the role was formed organically as leaders realized the need for integrated CRM management and email automation. True operations excellence requires a holistic view that covers the entire customer journey rather than just the initial sale.

    • •Many professionals currently titled in RevOps are actually focused solely on Sales Ops tasks.
    • •Broadening the scope to Marketing Ops and CS Ops is essential for true alignment.
    • •The term Go-To-Market Ops is preferred by veteran leaders for its accuracy.
    • •Recruitment algorithms heavily favor the RevOps keyword over more descriptive titles.
    • •Early practitioners of the role often had to re-title themselves after building the function.
    • •Successful operations require a deep friendship and collaboration with Salesforce developers.
    • •Breaking a domain with a million-person email can be a literal 'trial by fire' in ops.

    Scaling Tech Unicorns Through Systematic Configuration

    Building systems at Unicorn scale requires a shift in how leaders approach technology and processes. Whether at Box or Carta, the challenge is moving from early-stage chaos to a structured IPO-ready environment. Andy advocates for a configure-first mentality, where leaders leverage existing platforms to create value quickly without waiting for custom engineering resources.

    • •Leaders at Culture Amp and Carta must balance speed with long-term system stability.
    • •A world-class configurer can drive more impact than a traditional coder in ops.
    • •Scaling twice from early-stage to IPO provides a unique perspective on debt reduction.
    • •The transition from customizing tools to configuring platforms is a key maturity marker.
    • •Effective RevOps leaders think in logic and structures rather than just raw code.
    • •Using no-code tools allows operations teams to remain agile during rapid growth.
    • •Systematic thinking is the common thread between English lit majors and engineers in ops.

    Building Startups with No-Code and AI

    Modern entrepreneurship has changed, allowing non-technical founders to build Version 1 products using no-code stacks. Tools like Airtable, Zapier, and AppSmith serve as the foundation for complex databases and automation workflows. This approach allows founders to validate their ideas and build a connection graph before hiring a full-time engineering team to scale it further.

    • •The first version of Whispered was built entirely on Airtable and Zapier workflows.
    • •Founders can now code something up themselves without a computer science degree.
    • •Automating data entry and confidential insights is the first step in building a marketplace.
    • •Integrating AI tools can significantly lower the friction in high-level job searches.
    • •A connection graph allows professionals to leverage their network more efficiently.
    • •The Lovables and Cursors of the world are changing how we view software development.
    • •Prototyping with no-code tools reduces the risk and cost of early-stage startups.

    Decoding the Senior-Level Executive Search

    Searching for a VP-level role is often a lonely and intimidating process because high-level information is kept private. Andy's venture, Whispered, aims to solve this by creating a database of confidential insights shared among peers. By collecting data that people usually 'whisper' to one another, candidates can make better decisions about which Unicorn companies are actually worth joining.

    • •Senior executives often discard valuable interview data instead of sharing it.
    • •A Google Sheet of rockstar talent can eventually evolve into a full-scale startup.
    • •Job seekers need to know more than just the job description to make a choice.
    • •Confidentiality is key when sharing insights about corporate culture and leadership.
    • •Peer-to-peer Slack groups serve as a vital support network for executive-level leaders.
    • •The AI-powered search tool helps filter through roles that match a candidate's specific DNA.
    • •Connecting the right RevOps person to the right company is a form of specialized matchmaking.

    Frequently Asked Questions

    Key Takeaways

    GTM ScopeExpand GTM operations to include marketing and customer success.
    No-Code ToolsEmpower non-engineers to build strong products using no-code tools.
    Company CultureSeek confidential insights into company culture for senior roles.
    GTM BrandingUnderstand that 'GTM Ops' attracts fewer recruiters than 'RevOps'.
    Scaling StrategyShift from customizing to configuring systems when scaling to IPO.
    RevOps TalentRecognize RevOps professionals often come from diverse, logical backgrounds.
    Career GrowthBuild a personal connection graph to unlock career opportunities.
    Strategize